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	<title>Comments on: Careers Advice</title>
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	<description>is a sociological space about work, generating discussion and exchange on what work, paid or unpaid, is like in today’s world</description>
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		<title>By: Kate Bradley</title>
		<link>http://nowaytomakealiving.net/post/663/comment-page-1#comment-71</link>
		<dc:creator>Kate Bradley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Apr 2010 11:26:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://nowaytomakealiving.net/?p=663#comment-71</guid>
		<description>Interesting coming to this when starting to get my thoughts together about an event on e-portfolios and PRP (the link should come up).  The project we are working on is a pedagogic enterprise, aimed at enabling students to develop their abilities to reflect on their skills and abilities and to come up with a convincing narrative of themselves for employers/future studies.  It has benefits for &#039;study&#039; and &#039;work&#039;, if these terms can be meaningfully divided when talking about students and, indeed, with researchers in academia, think-tanks etc.  We&#039;re not coming at it from the &#039;careers advice&#039; angle, thus we&#039;re not working on giving people advice but rather tools for handling their entry into the workplace... again, very social capital, very Bourdieu in its thinking.  

I think the point of it all - what we are doing and other people are elsewhere - is trying, possibly futilely, to help students who would probably not have been at university ten, twenty, thirty years ago to *act* in graduate-like ways.  &#039;Graduate&#039; jobs require a lot of narrative and reflection on the part of the applicant, particularly if they are milkrounding it.  If this is beyond the experiences of your family and friends, how do you learn to do this, if it&#039;s what you want?  Who can mentor you?  How do you get beyond or change the ways in which so many of the professions have typically recruited &#039;new&#039; members through an exclusive use of social and cultural capital... families of doctors... the public school and Oxbridge &#039;old boy&#039; network... &#039;recognised&#039; routes such as studying x at y Oxbridge college if you want to do z, that don&#039;t always make it into the careers advice guides... If we think it is important that the composition of our professions reflect our society, then this is a major issue.  Equally, with the newer &#039;brain&#039; or creative industries, the routes in may be more fluid but class still has an impact, through knowing who you know, being able to take internships or crapply-paid jobs, being able to raise capital for a start-up...  in many ways it seems as though education since the 1960s has moved far more towards a notion of meritocracy than the working world has, wants or needs (or knows it wants or needs).  Thus our students/graduates need to be able to talk two &#039;languages&#039; and to be able to build up their social capital....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting coming to this when starting to get my thoughts together about an event on e-portfolios and PRP (the link should come up).  The project we are working on is a pedagogic enterprise, aimed at enabling students to develop their abilities to reflect on their skills and abilities and to come up with a convincing narrative of themselves for employers/future studies.  It has benefits for ‘study’ and ‘work’, if these terms can be meaningfully divided when talking about students and, indeed, with researchers in academia, think-tanks etc.  We’re not coming at it from the ‘careers advice’ angle, thus we’re not working on giving people advice but rather tools for handling their entry into the workplace… again, very social capital, very Bourdieu in its thinking.  </p>
<p>I think the point of it all — what we are doing and other people are elsewhere — is trying, possibly futilely, to help students who would probably not have been at university ten, twenty, thirty years ago to *act* in graduate-like ways.  ‘Graduate’ jobs require a lot of narrative and reflection on the part of the applicant, particularly if they are milkrounding it.  If this is beyond the experiences of your family and friends, how do you learn to do this, if it’s what you want?  Who can mentor you?  How do you get beyond or change the ways in which so many of the professions have typically recruited ‘new’ members through an exclusive use of social and cultural capital… families of doctors… the public school and Oxbridge ‘old boy’ network… ‘recognised’ routes such as studying x at y Oxbridge college if you want to do z, that don’t always make it into the careers advice guides… If we think it is important that the composition of our professions reflect our society, then this is a major issue.  Equally, with the newer ‘brain’ or creative industries, the routes in may be more fluid but class still has an impact, through knowing who you know, being able to take internships or crapply-paid jobs, being able to raise capital for a start-up…  in many ways it seems as though education since the 1960s has moved far more towards a notion of meritocracy than the working world has, wants or needs (or knows it wants or needs).  Thus our students/graduates need to be able to talk two ‘languages’ and to be able to build up their social capital.…</p>
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		<title>By: fourcultures</title>
		<link>http://nowaytomakealiving.net/post/663/comment-page-1#comment-61</link>
		<dc:creator>fourcultures</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Apr 2010 08:32:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://nowaytomakealiving.net/?p=663#comment-61</guid>
		<description>My friend Dave told me he had one interview with a careers adviser at age 15. It went:
&quot;Mill or pit?&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My friend Dave told me he had one interview with a careers adviser at age 15. It went:<br />
“Mill or pit?”</p>
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		<title>By: Lynne</title>
		<link>http://nowaytomakealiving.net/post/663/comment-page-1#comment-54</link>
		<dc:creator>Lynne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 16:52:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://nowaytomakealiving.net/?p=663#comment-54</guid>
		<description>Dawn, you&#039;re right. You so often are.

Ben, you&#039;re asking me to engineer the souls of my students; seriously, i&#039;m not (we&#039;re not) that powerful. There&#039;s no recognition of structure in what you say. 
As for not being convinced that there&#039;s much to be said for teaching them about the sociology of work, I&#039;m stunned: spending all this time making sense of why work is organised how it is, but then not telling the students about that, right at the time when many of them are thinking about moving full time into the workforce, doesn&#039;t make sense to me. 

Randy, welcome!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dawn, you’re right. You so often are.</p>
<p>Ben, you’re asking me to engineer the souls of my students; seriously, i’m not (we’re not) that powerful. There’s no recognition of structure in what you say.<br />
As for not being convinced that there’s much to be said for teaching them about the sociology of work, I’m stunned: spending all this time making sense of why work is organised how it is, but then not telling the students about that, right at the time when many of them are thinking about moving full time into the workforce, doesn’t make sense to me. </p>
<p>Randy, welcome!</p>
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		<title>By: Dawn Lyon</title>
		<link>http://nowaytomakealiving.net/post/663/comment-page-1#comment-53</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawn Lyon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Mar 2010 15:13:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://nowaytomakealiving.net/?p=663#comment-53</guid>
		<description>Even if you can’t see career ladders clearly anymore, I think you underplay the structuring of opportunities in this and the processes of matching people to jobs beyond what their agency can make happen. A third point to tell the students then is that you can’t just decide! especially since sometimes class matters more later in working lives than earlier. Sociological advice could also include identifying what ‘bridges’ there are between different jobs and trajectories, how some paths close down others and vice versa. And the importance of social capital suggests that students should make as many smart friends as possible whilst they’re still at University…!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Even if you can’t see career ladders clearly anymore, I think you underplay the structuring of opportunities in this and the processes of matching people to jobs beyond what their agency can make happen. A third point to tell the students then is that you can’t just decide! especially since sometimes class matters more later in working lives than earlier. Sociological advice could also include identifying what ‘bridges’ there are between different jobs and trajectories, how some paths close down others and vice versa. And the importance of social capital suggests that students should make as many smart friends as possible whilst they’re still at University…!</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Anderson</title>
		<link>http://nowaytomakealiving.net/post/663/comment-page-1#comment-52</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Anderson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Mar 2010 11:47:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://nowaytomakealiving.net/?p=663#comment-52</guid>
		<description>so we need to help them to engineer luck &amp; happenstance. Like engineering serendipity. Part of it is what resources you have to draw on (skills &amp; capabilities &amp; confidence) and part of it is what activities you take to generate the luck.
 
I&#039;m not convinced that teaching them about the &#039;sociology of work&#039; will help (much). But teaching them about the &#039;work&#039; of sociology might...

And so we need to start thinking about the nature of a &#039;sociology industry&#039;: what kinds of skills does it require, what kind of sophistications and orientations? What is a &#039;practical sociology&#039;? And how does it relate to &#039;open&#039; sociology?

Savage &amp; Burrows have &lt;a href=&quot;http://soc.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/41/5/885&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;some thoughts&lt;/a&gt; which I&#039;ve sort of &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.slideshare.net/essexsociology/the-sociological-value-of-transactional-data-3337678&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;developed&lt;/a&gt; :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>so we need to help them to engineer luck &amp; happenstance. Like engineering serendipity. Part of it is what resources you have to draw on (skills &amp; capabilities &amp; confidence) and part of it is what activities you take to generate the luck.</p>
<p>I’m not convinced that teaching them about the ‘sociology of work’ will help (much). But teaching them about the ‘work’ of sociology might…</p>
<p>And so we need to start thinking about the nature of a ‘sociology industry’: what kinds of skills does it require, what kind of sophistications and orientations? What is a ‘practical sociology’? And how does it relate to ‘open’ sociology?</p>
<p>Savage &amp; Burrows have <a href="http://soc.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/41/5/885" rel="nofollow">some thoughts</a> which I’ve sort of <a href="http://www.slideshare.net/essexsociology/the-sociological-value-of-transactional-data-3337678" rel="nofollow">developed</a> <img src='http://nowaytomakealiving.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Randy Pena</title>
		<link>http://nowaytomakealiving.net/post/663/comment-page-1#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>Randy Pena</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Mar 2010 15:28:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://nowaytomakealiving.net/?p=663#comment-50</guid>
		<description>I discovered your homepage by coincidence.
Very interesting posts and well written.
I will put your site on my blogroll.
:-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I discovered your homepage by coincidence.<br />
Very interesting posts and well written.<br />
I will put your site on my blogroll.<br />
 <img src='http://nowaytomakealiving.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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